An audience that trusts creators will trust your brand too.
When Brendan McDonald, podcasting pioneer and producer for “WTF with Marc Maron,” decided to give podcasting a try, grounded by his background in radio production, he knew he could create something special, something new and uncharted.
Maron and McDonald debuted “WTF” in September 2009 as an interview style show that dives deep into the lives of Maron’s guests and news of the day, without fixed expectations. They knew they wanted to serve great content backed by a quality sound – and an avenue that directly connected them to their audience.
“We knew this should be produced like professional radio and it wasn’t going to be just turning our mics on to talk…I think one of the tricks Marc and I pulled early on was that this was a highly produced product that was geared toward people who can appreciate professional, quality audio,” McDonald said.
Nearly 16 years later, “WTF” has more than 1.1 billion downloads, 600 million views on YouTube with over 60,000 subscribers. As the years ticked by and its guests became higher profile, aided by Joanna Jordan, CEO and founder of Central Talent Booking, the landscape of podcasting shifted. There’s greater autonomy, reach and fewer gaps between creators and brands, McDonald said.
As the sun sets on “WTF,” which will end sometime this fall, McDonald and Jordan shared some of their biggest takeaways about what the podcast industry has taught them – and what PR pros should know.
Here’s what they learned.
Podcasts boost direct relationships with brands and listeners
The very nature of podcasts feeds the idea that the content is more personal, seeping into your home, gym routine or workday. It feels like the creator is speaking directly to you at your convenience, McDonald said.
Brands have the same idea.
“Brands are really trying to get directly to the creators,” Jordan said. “They don’t really want a middleman.”
Eliminating the middleman means that brands can be unfiltered, sharing a message in their own words for their target audience, one that will resonate directly, on a deeper level.
For a show like “WTF,” which McDonald said was rooted in respect and ease, this means that brands working with them are seen in the same light.
When a direct relationship is established, it’s a more effective strategy, McDonald said. There are more possibilities for collaborations.
Throughout the years, “WTF” has worked with brands that the creators believe in, rather than just because an opportunity presented itself.
Speaking to Acast, “WTF’s” podcast distribution partner, McDonald said that “the best advertisers are the ones who trust our process and know that we’ll take good care of representing them on the show.”
He recalled when drink company Liquid Death came on board, they gave Maron and McDonald a lot of freedom to present the product in a way that worked for them, in whatever format they wanted.
“We’ll never take that trust for granted,” McDonald said.
Because “WTF’s” audience is extremely loyal, they’re going to trust in the brands that are promoted, because they trust Maron, McDonald said.
Authentic engagement breeds trust
As “WTF” built a following, it was clear that the podcast’s reputation was backed by Maron’s transparency with his guests and an intimacy brought forth from candid conversations with his A-list line up. The show’s reach continued to grow.
The quality of the show’s content is crucial for establishing trust with listeners, McDonald said, adding that Maron “basically creates a unique portrait of (his guests) just by having a conversation.”
Because brands strive to reach their audience authentically, when a podcast’s reputation is lifted up by this principle, it makes it simpler for them to also foster trust and credibility from an audience that respects the people sharing their message, Jordan said.
The emphasis on authenticity is underscored by brands that “want to develop great relationships with creators,” Jordan said. Not just brand partnerships, but trusted relationships.
A space for seamless integration
Consumers tire easily from sales pitches. Consumers also have short attention spans. Podcasts allow brands to reach audiences with ease, by integrating their messages into the content itself.
Brands want “to be able to incorporate what they’re doing in a very seamless way,” which enhances the listener experience by blending brand messages naturally, Jordan said.
When listeners feel like content isn’t forced, they’re going to pay attention to what’s being said as a part of the show rather than feeling like they’re pausing for an ad.
Part of this strategy plays into how content is presented, McDonald said. “Marc likes to natively insert (ads) into the show,” or in other words, it doesn’t feel like an ad or sales pitch. “We have, since day one, never put ads in interviews.”
Maron makes his transitions from interview to promotion seamless, so it doesn’t feel like an ad at all.
By making brand partnerships feel more conversational, real and applicable, creators can work with organizations to share information in a way that feels less intrusive.
The goal of “WTF” has always been “did this wind up being a conversation that someone listening to it took something away that they haven’t heard before?” McDonald said. This idea applies across the board and into its brand partnerships, he said.
For deeper insights and data on why pitching podcasts like “WTF with Marc Maron” is a critical strategy, join Ragan’s Communications Leadership Council.
Courtney Blackann is a communications reporter. Connect with her on LinkedIn or email her at courtneyb@ragan.com.
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